Boys & Girls...............

[creme anglais]

This is a thread I have also started on the Pendragon forum...............
I wondered what you guys thought,

So, why do you think it is that the male/female ratio is so uneven in the prog world???
Why, when you go to a gig is 80% of the audience fellas? (the baby sitting theory dosn't hold up.....it seems to have always this way!)
Why, are 80% of the forum members fellas?

so why is it that prog does not seem to attract the girls?

I ask these questions, because someone said to me today that they could never "pull" at a prog gig.........(obviously a guy said this!)

And girlies.........how comfortable would you feel going to a prog gig on your own?
and why do you think that you (like me) are into a type of music that probably most of your female friends would turn their noses up at?

thoughts please!?!?!?!?


CAx

[Peter]

If I knew an answer to this....

I can only tell you how my wife reacts to my music:

a) Arena, Porcupine Tree, Marillion etc. (which is the softer side for me)
-> She sighs. Loudly.

b) Ayreon, Dream Theater, Shadow Gallery etc. (which is the heavy side)
-> Please! Use your headphones!

In turn I make her use her headphones when she pulls out Celine Dion, Streisand or the like
The only music we can listen to together is Robbie Williams (sic!, I think he's a brilliant musician) or Kuschelrock (I don't know an english word for it: music to cuddle to).

[Higgins III]

I think that the reason not many girls like prog is because girls who do like prog have better taste and indeed a wider taste range in music which makes them all the more interesting

I think the reason there are no girls at gigs is because of the fact that there is so many guys and that they don't have loads of other girls to go with because prog is more of an aquired taste with girls.

Im not sure why prog doesn't attract girls but the girls that it does attract are much more interesting because they have a wide taste range and in my eyes are more desirable.

[Saryna]

Hey there!  Hope some of you are getting to see them on this tour!

Creme, there is another thread in this same grouping called "Men to women ratio" where we threw some thoughts around.  You might want to check that thread out also.

And thanks for the 'varied taste' compliment someone said.  I resemble that remark.

[POM]

I'm going saturday to see Arena... I 'm not going alone: we'll be 6... and I'll be the only girl! 

I must say that first I was like Peter"s wife!
But instead of asking my boyfriend to put headphones, I just interessed myself to what he was listening to, because music is important to him ... and he's important to me... so...

To enjoy prog like Ayreon, Dreamtheater,... it needs  time I think.  I never like the albums the 3-4 first times I listen to it. But then, there's a moment I really feel like... I'm into ! And then ... it's magic!
I was "afraid" by going to see DT last time my boyfriend went to see them.  Octavarium is more "accessible", I'm now enjoying "Scene from a Memory"  (just can't get it out of me cd-player)...

So I would say that maybe girls don't take the time to listen correctely to prog music.
And maybe we're used to "commercial" music more than boys? Just taking what radio or real-tv is giving ?
Maybe we're afraid to go and see a band of prog and get stuck in a crowd of men dressed in leather, with long hair and drinking too much beer? (seems to be the image some girls have of an audience listening to prog)

[Higgins III]

Hmmmmm. Still with this information it still obviously shows there are more guys than girls who like prog. I'll cruise round my web sites and other forums to try to get some more insight and then i'll either put it on here for them or they will sign up and do it themselfs. We need a wider selection of people to ask this very interesting and constantly deepening and complex question

[keyboardistmatt]

Hmmmmm. Still with this information it still obviously shows there are more guys than girls who like prog. I'll cruise round my web sites and other forums to try to get some more insight and then i'll either put it on here for them or they will sign up and do it themselfs. We need a wider selection of people to ask this very interesting and constantly deepening and complex question

I thought that...

[Higgins III]

Lol.  . They do say great minds think alike

[keyboardistmatt]

I thought that...

(sarcasm...)

[Higgins III]

Make your mind up  . Well i know i have a great mind. Remember im a black belt...........in origami. (wow. i havn't heard that 1 before )

The sarcasm wasn't clear dearest. Either i didn't pick up on it or you need to state sarcasm more obviously love. 

[keyboardistmatt]

Thank you...


That was SARCASM!!! brought to you by keyboardistmatt.

[Proglady]

So, why do you think it is that the male/female ratio is so uneven in the prog world???
Why, when you go to a gig is 80% of the audience fellas?

Most of the fellas I know aren't interestet in prog music  They even say to me that I have a creazy music tast 

And girlies.........how comfortable would you feel going to a prog gig on your own?
and why do you think that you (like me) are into a type of music that probably most of your female friends would turn their noses up at?

I am very comfortable going on a prog gig alone, because I want to see and hear the Band that I admire and don't care if there are more fellas than gielies.   
I'm into prog music for about 30 years know, because of mostly good lyrics wich makes you think about what the musicians is trying to tell and good melodies, essentialy the Longtracks. Hm, but I don't like when the music is turning to complex, like with Gong, or King Crimson.
I thing most girlies and some fellas don't like prog, because they can't dance to it.

It's not easy to write in a language that you're not speaking every day 

[Wurensh]

I feel the same way as prog lady, I love prog since I was 15 or so (I actually cried when Fish left Marillion, how pityful is that...) and I've been to many many concerts, some by myself, but I like it more when I can share the passion with someone, most of the time it's my husband, who got into prog partly because of me ! Our kids are now growing up with hearing Arena, Dream Theater, Ayreon and IQ, but we have two boys....
I'm 36 by the way. I'm in it for the great solo's, the unpredictability and the lyrics.

And can we talk about the sort of men that come to these gigs now ?

Mariska

[keyboardistmatt]

And can we talk about the sort of men that come to these gigs now ?

I believe lots of us have long hair...

[creme anglais]

judging from the recent gig's I have been to............... there is definately LESS hair now amongst the boys than there was maybe 10-15 years ago!!!!!


;DCAx

[POM]

I was at the gig in Verviers, saturday and..... I so more girls than 2 years ago 
Something about 40% of the audience I think...

[Moonloop]

I know this is something of a sweeping generalisation, but IMHO most women see music as something to have on in the background whilst they're doing something else whereas blokes take music 'seriously' and want to study it in a headphone environment. Hence, prog tends to be a male dominated genre because it's not immediate and/or melodic enough. 

[keyboardistmatt]

I know this is something of a sweeping generalisation, but IMHO most women see music as something to have on in the background whilst they're doing something else whereas blokes take music 'seriously' and want to study it in a headphone environment. Hence, prog tends to be a male dominated genre because it's not immediate and/or melodic enough. 

Agreed.  There is alot more going on within the various guises of Prog...

[gelert]

Having carried-out an exhaustive survey of 1...

...I can categorically report that hoovering / clothes washing / cooking is carried-out with less "whinging", if Pendragon has been playing on the "Chateau Gelert" jukebox throughout the entire mission.

However, should "Citizen Cain", "Cardiacs", or any other, er, "adventurous" piece-of-prog be played during "The Mission"...

...then "The Mission" quality suffers, if completed at all...

Therefore proving, once-and-for-all, that Arena don't promote "sexism", but Pendragon, er, "do"....!

Er, or something... 


Must dash....
My turn on The Hoover, er, apparently...


Yippee................................




Cover me, I'm going in....

[creme anglais]

  Gelert!

That is SO true!
I find I can complete household tasks with piped Pendragon, Jadis, Arena, Shdowland, IQ...........but there are what I call "spikey-prog" bands..........that I could not complete a.........er........ anything......thing.......... if they were being played! In fact I might even strike/consult the union/bugger-off to the shops.....

maybe thats the thing, maybe there is "girl-prog" and "blokie-prog"

[kmorse]

After pondering, I've come up with this list of tasks and music I find myself listening to while doing them:

Yard work: Kansas, Dream Theater, IQ, Pallas, Jadis, Rush, Arena
Computer programming: Arena, IQ,
Dishwashing: King Crimson, Renaissance, Strawbs
Riding home on the bus (1-hr commute): Whatever I've just bought and want to really listen to.
Driving in car alone: Any of the above plus stuff like Robin Trower, The Who, Cream, Steve Hackett
Driving in car with wife: Peter Gabriel, late-Collins-era Genesis, Sting, Craig Chaquico, Neal Schon

[Moonloop]

maybe thats the thing, maybe there is "girl-prog" and "blokie-prog"

Somebody help me....I like girl-prog   

[Xanxtuary]

Refer to my reply on the Pendragon forums!

I have given up trying to convert female relatives and friends to try prog and trying to reason as to why so many females either don't like it or won't give it a chance in the first place.  It seems to me as though a lot of them are determined not to like it!

I have always been very much in the musical minority among family and friends and I suppose over the past 20 years I have just learned to accept the situation.

I've never actually been to a gig on my own, although I have been to the cinema and some other events many times on my own.  Being there unaccompanied wouldn't bother me as long as I could have either reliable transport home afterwards or somewhere very near and convenient to crash (friend's house or whatever).

As for performing household tasks, I prefer to have straightforward raucous rock music or blues blasting out, but when I'm at my computer, I listen to pretty much any of my favoured genres.  I do like headphone listening and before I knew Hogweed, most of my prog listening was done on headphones.

Walter Trout's music is excellent for wallpaper stripping and painting, although last time we did painting, we did put Pendragon's Paintbox on ...

[PH]

Generally Progrock is something for intellectuals.
(Don't flame me for that)
People who listen to progrock look further than their own horizons.

I call this sort of music 'Verder-dan-je-neus-lang-is'-music. (If you want to know what the translation is, ask someone else )

[maddox]

I call this sort of music 'Verder-dan-je-neus-lang-is'-music. (If you want to know what the translation is, ask someone else )

Farther than your tall nose???



MAD.