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What is the status in Arena?

Started by cabo, Sun, 2007-12-30, 22:54:12

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Bupie

Quote from: ironcow2103 on Thu, 2008-01-24, 23:39:25
Well according to my rough and ready iTunes playlist you have about six miuntes spare so I've addded in Purgatory Road because that is great too...  :)

Actually, I was hoping for an extended version of Crying for Help to get to one hour...  ;)

Petrucci

#26
Hello everybody ! ;)

I am a big young French fan of Arena since the beginning (sorry for my English...). I have almost all CDs (but for example, I don't have "Ten years on", What's the news ?).

I think The Visitor is the best album, very homogeneous, very inspired musicians, not too short... I went to the gig of Arena in Lyon (Le Transbordeur) after The visitor had been released, it was great !

It's a very good idea to have a forum about Arena, and Clive Nolan participates a lot, even if the others members of the band don't.

However, I am disapointed by Arena because I thought that band could be a leader (a little like Dream Theater) but there is no activity, it seems that the band contents  "to live" only with its old albums (nothing for the last 3 years !).
Since Pepper's Ghost (or Immortal ?), I have the impression that Arena don't progress, and worse, regresses. I think the public of Arena is very reduce (and for the progressive in general), but how is it possible to grow if the band doesn't offer more than one new album during 6 years ?

Someone said to me that the progressive is sad, I don't think so. Dream Theater is a progressive band and has a big success thanks to an intensive activity, great AND varied albums. Today, Arena give me the impression of an old band while it's only about 10 years old !

I really hope Arena has a future and I wish Clive Nolan (and others) lot of inspiration for the next album ! ;)   

Deenfan

We can only hope. I think Arena beats all the "competition" in the song writing department, and they also have the power of magic.

I am in the sad situation that I feel DT has completely lost it, even though the last one included better songs than in a long while. Arena is probably not "flashy" enough to make it really big. Silent contemplation never got the mob going, to put it that way. ;)

Appelmoes??

The difference between DT and Arena (I feel) is that Arena takes the time to make a good album. The're not satisfied with a "so so" product, they won't give us a new album that isn't the best they can do. Where as DT gives us a new album almost every year just to keep up their average.
If taking the time for an album will bring me a masterpiece instead of an album where I keep thinking "this could have been better, that could have been better" I'm willing to wait for it.

You also have to take in mind that Arena is a much smaller band than DT. Because they are more progressive they don't get as much attention as DT which has evolved into (prog.) metal, and thus has a bigger group of people it can target. Because they are bigger and get more monies, DT can invest more time into new albums.
For some good reading visit:""Fluffy Kittens of DOOM"!

My drawings on MySpace


The Butterfly Man

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Fri, 2008-03-14, 17:07:57
DT gives us a new album almost every year just to keep up their average.

First: I think it's a bit harsh to say that DT releases albums just to 'keep up their average'.

Second: It is so not true! When you compare the 2 bands you'll find that Arena released 6 studio-albums in 13 years and that DT released 9 studio-albums in almost 23 years.

With these 'numbers' you'll see that Arena's average lies with a new album every 2 year whereas DT's average is 2,5 year...

Sorry to sound like some smarta$$ but I just think DT deserves more credit than you give them...

Tom


There will be white clouds beyond the hills...

Bupie

Quote from: Petrucci on Fri, 2008-03-14, 14:12:49
Hello everybody ! ;)

I am a big young French fan of Arena since the beginning (sorry for my English...).

Ah, un compatriote !  ;) Bon, je repasse à l'anglais ...

Are you a member of the French Your Majesty's forum ? Let us know about your musical tastes apart from DT.

Quote from: The Butterfly Man on Fri, 2008-03-14, 18:28:16
Sorry to sound like some smarta$$ but I just think DT deserves more credit than you give them...

I join you here. I love both bands but obviously you can not compare their fame. DT is much more known worldwide but I think it's due in part to the fact that they attract a fringe of heavy metal audience that Arena's music is not apt to seduce.

And I think it's also honest to notice that people in Arena -at least Clive and John- are involved in a lot of projects and/or other bands, Clive being a key member of Pendragon and John of It Bites. That takes A LOT of time off from Arena. Of course, members of DT, especially Mike, have also side projects but to me, today, DT is a full time job when Arena is not.



Deenfan

Quote from: The Butterfly Man on Fri, 2008-03-14, 18:28:16
First: I think it's a bit harsh to say that DT releases albums just to 'keep up their average'.

Second: It is so not true! When you compare the 2 bands you'll find that Arena released 6 studio-albums in 13 years and that DT released 9 studio-albums in almost 23 years.

With these 'numbers' you'll see that Arena's average lies with a new album every 2 year whereas DT's average is 2,5 year...

Sorry to sound like some smarta$$ but I just think DT deserves more credit than you give them...

Tom


DT's first album came out in 1989. That is 19 years ago, maximum. The average point still holds true, though. But it feels (the word Appel used) like DT comes along with another product (with a deliberate new direction) all the time. But even so, I'm not sure they are able to make a truly magnificent album any more no matter how much time they spend on it. :-\

Nicky007

#32
I couldnt disagree more with you, Appy and Deenie  :)

I love Arena music, period !  However, for me, DT have settled at the absolute top, beyond all competition, the greatest rock group since Pink Floyd's Meddle to Final Cut period. All DT albums from Images on are masterpieces, and DT are simply getting better and better, increasingly varied and striking in their expression  *horns*

You can listen to a DT album a million times, and the million and first time, you'l still be hearing new things and having new experiences.

Nicky.
So you've come of age
And so you want to meet God
Sure you can
He's right here next to me

PH

#33
Conclusion: it's personal.
I'm a bit between. I love Dream Theater's music (and Arena's music) but I also agree that they seem to be on automatic pilot. They've got a machine, you put something in it, and a song comes out. It seems to work most of the time, but Dream Theater has a system to write their songs. That's not bad per se.
And they make something I'd like to call "muscle music" in which the music is in service of the solo spots. (Which I really like by the way!)
With Arena it's more organic... I don't know how to explain. But this is how I feel it. Their music is a "whole", the solos are in service of the music.

Besides, Arena and Dream Theater are totally different. Different moods, different take on the instrumentation, different view on life, different stage presence, different fanbase and different way of communicating with this fanbase.

Two bands, you cannot compare... And some like the one and hate the other, and some like them both in different ways.


-Paco

bluepony

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Fri, 2008-03-14, 17:07:57
You also have to take in mind that Arena is a much smaller band than DT. Because they are more progressive they don't get as much attention as DT which has evolved into (prog.) metal, and thus has a bigger group of people it can target. Because they are bigger and get more monies, DT can invest more time into new albums.

Hmmm... so you're saying if Arena were more 'metal', the band would get more fans?!  :o
(Which, by the way, would be fine by me - both the 'reaching more fans' and the 'more metal'!  ;D
But mind you - I'm not suggesting Arena should turn into a metal band...!)

Petrucci

I don't say that DT is a model. The last two albums are not so good and for example Petrucci himself told he's not as well inspirated as before.
When I speak about Arena, it's not nasty critics, but only regrets.
And what I regret it's a lack of ambition from the band:
-The members are involved in a lot of projects, and it seems that Arena is not a priority for most of members. Actually, Arena isn't a full time job for most of members. A few months ago I was afraid Arena disappears.
-I have the impression that the sound doesn't really evoluate, DT has made lots of varied albums and it's allows a progression, a renewal, and to attract new fans.
Also, if I think  to release one CD by year is a weakness for the quality of CDs of DT; to release a CD 3 years after the last is not necessarily a strength for Arena because lots of members make others things during this time in others bands.


Quote from: Bupie on Fri, 2008-03-14, 19:57:58

Are you a member of the French Your Majesty's forum ? Let us know about your musical tastes apart from DT.


No, I am not ! But I have got all fanzines since the beginning until 3 years ago.
My tastes are not very varied... I can say that I like only Arena, DT and maybe Pendragon. There are lots of others bands that I appreciate but I don't like all that they have made: Frost, Saga, Magellan, Pink Floyd, Deep Purple...

PH

Quote from: bluepony on Sat, 2008-03-15, 12:57:17Hmmm... so you're saying if Arena were more 'metal', the band would get more fans?!  :o

I think that's true. It's only logical!
"Prog" is not exactly loved amongst the majority. But there are large groups of metal heads. When you combine these two (Prog metal) you capture both styles and, therefore, both fans.
(You see this very strongly with Opeth. It's 100% metal, but also 100% progressive. Although the grunting could make that a few proggers walk away from it.)
But the question is, do we want that?
I want Arena to be just the way it is: progressive 'thinking' rock. ;)
I'm not sure whether the label 'metal' would suit Arena. Of course they evolved into a bit hard-edged prog, but it shouldn't get much heavier, in my humble opinion.
For the heavier moods we have Dream Theater or Opeth and the likes. Although I don't think of Dream Theater as a heavy metal band... They are different.


-Paco

Peter

What was this thread all about? And in what section was it again? ...
Arriving somewhere, but not here....

bluepony


PH

Quote from: Peter on Sat, 2008-03-15, 15:24:14What was this thread all about? And in what section was it again? ...

Sorry, you're right... I'm sorry sir...

Where did it go wrong?

Nicky007

#40
Quote from: PH on Sat, 2008-03-15, 11:49:47
I'm a bit between. I love Dream Theater's music (and Arena's music) but I also agree that they seem to be on automatic pilot. They've got a machine, you put something in it, and a song comes out. It seems to work most of the time, but Dream Theater has a system to write their songs. That's not bad per se.
And they make something I'd like to call "muscle music" in which the music is in service of the solo spots. (Which I really like by the way!)

Paco, I simply can't believe that you'v written this  :'(

There's soooo much soul and yearning in the music of DT, man - have we been listening to the same group ?  You call Ministry and Forsaken "muscle music" ?  These are some of the most introspective and soul-searching songs I'v ever heard.

Seems to be a common notion that soul and technical ability are complementary (the more you have of one, the less you have of the other). I find this a total misconception !

Nicky.
So you've come of age
And so you want to meet God
Sure you can
He's right here next to me

PH

Quote from: Nicky007 on Sat, 2008-03-15, 19:56:13Paco, I simply can't believe that you'v written this  :'(
I wrote it, and I mean it. But for me that doesn't mean that they're bad. I really like muscle music. Especially Dream Theater's muscle music. Gives me adrenaline. ;)

And they indeed have a couple of songs with soul.
And Arena has some muscle songs too.

cabo

Quote from: Peter on Sat, 2008-03-15, 15:24:14
What was this thread all about? And in what section was it again? ...

It seems like all other progbands in the UK is recording excerpt Arena :(


bluepony

Quote from: cabo on Tue, 2008-03-18, 18:49:03
It seems like all other progbands in the UK is recording excerpt Arena :(

Well, Arena started writing the new album - that's rather good news!  :)

Appelmoes??

Quote from: The Butterfly Man on Fri, 2008-03-14, 18:28:16
First: I think it's a bit harsh to say that DT releases albums just to 'keep up their average'.

Second: It is so not true! When you compare the 2 bands you'll find that Arena released 6 studio-albums in 13 years and that DT released 9 studio-albums in almost 23 years.

With these 'numbers' you'll see that Arena's average lies with a new album every 2 year whereas DT's average is 2,5 year...

Sorry to sound like some smarta$$ but I just think DT deserves more credit than you give them...

Tom
I should have said that I also include their live-albums, they have quite a few. But even then you could be right :-[  But let's talk about Arena again :P
For some good reading visit:""Fluffy Kittens of DOOM"!

My drawings on MySpace


Deenfan


cabo

Quote from: bluepony on Tue, 2008-03-18, 20:49:56
Well, Arena started writing the new album - that's rather good news!  :)

Yeah, because Arena is really good music!!! One album album each year!! :)

Appelmoes??

Quote from: bluepony on Tue, 2008-03-18, 20:49:56
Well, Arena started writing the new album - that's rather good news!  :)
Das ist himmlisch! :)
For some good reading visit:""Fluffy Kittens of DOOM"!

My drawings on MySpace


Deenfan


maddox

Cause of Injury: Lack of Adhesive Ducks.