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CDs "On Demand"

Started by Moonloop, Tue, 2005-02-08, 12:42:40

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Moonloop

Don't know whether anyone else has heard of this new 'concept' but it has REALLY annoyed me.

Audiostreet have an explanatory page on it. It looks like certain record labels have given the rights/permission for a company to press silver CDRs of certain deleted/out of print titles. They're taking great pains to maintain that the audio quality hasn't suffered, which means that it probably has, the packaging is front & back cover only (no booklet, lyrics etc) and they're selling for £9.49 + p&p, ie, an inferior product for the price of a 'standard' one.

It's basically legalised copying but instead of your mate doing it for the price of a 70p CDR, you get to pay a tenner, same as a normal CD. I'd be VERY surprised if the artists see much by the way of royalties either, another example of corporate greed  ripping off Joe Public.

I think there're a few hundred titles so far including the illusive All About Eve albums "Touched by Jesus" & "Ultraviolet". The prog world isn't affected (for obvious reasons) but it's certainly the thin end of the wedge.

Grrr, etc

>:(

The brainwashed do not know that they are brainwashed...

gelert

Tricky one, Loopy....

If 'your mate' has a copy of the CD that you're after, and it's NOT available to buy REPUTABLY (even through the band's website if there is one), then I think that when the Music Police catch up with you and demand their "pound of flesh", that you'd be well within your rights to say "if the record company and / or artist had made it available for purchase, then I would have bought it. As it was, through my best efforts, I was unable to secure a COMMERCIAL copy."

However, if 'your mate' has a copy of the CD that you're after, but it IS available to buy REPUTABLY, then it's your decision whether or not to cheat the band and / or record company out of their profit.

And now I come to what I consider to be the crux of the problem...because this so-called "service" is NOW being offered - ergo, to supply deleted etc. copies - then it smacks of BLATANT LOOPHOLE PLUGGING, namely that it NOW totally negates the fall-back position that I mentioned above "if the record company and / or artist had made it available for purchase, then I would have bought it. As it was, through my best efforts, I was unable to secure a COMMERCIAL copy." Even if, at the time you had copied your mates' CD, this service was unable / unwilling to supply you with the relevant product, when it came to court, this "unavailability" would have disappeared faster than my dog on Firework Night...! And in it's place would be a statement to the effect that "Such-and-such is in fact one of our more popular requests, and therefore the accused, a certain Mr. M. Loopy, is guilty of piracy on the high seas...!"

The only defence that you could mount would be along the lines of a time-and-dated statement (e-mail etc) that "Such-and-such is unavailable at this time" from said service. AND, PERHAPS MORE IMPORTANTLY, also the argument, that the artwork / packaging is not up to the standard that you are WITHIN YOUR RIGHTS to expect from a COMMERCIAL release. Therefore, it follows that this cannot be considered a Bone Fide commercial release, thus underpinning the previous argument that it's availability is, at best, limited. But... -  good luck....!

However, if your mate doesn't have a copy; and the band's website and record company doesn't have product to sell, and is NEVER (never say never...!) going to re-release and / or remaster; and you sold your vinyl copies years ago (and are now gnashing your teeth over this fact)...then ANY copy on CD - i.e. without vinyl clicks and obvious cassette-tape hiss, with or without B&W "Artwork" is going to be welcome. See my request for "Information leading to the safe arrest and conviction of Duffo, Shabby Tiger, Ananta, etc CD's", elsewhere on this forum....

As to whether or not the artistes will get to see any royalties from these sales - well, the only guaranteed winners of this argument will be the lawyers.....yawn, same-old same-old... Although there is an organisation (that I was reading about in Sound-On-Sound magazine about 6 months ago), run by a lady, that seems very much on the side of the artistes and small "cottage-industry" independent record labels, against the majors. And she was saying that her organisation are very on-top-of the "off-the-shelf" downloadable and across-the-counter compilations-style Point-Of-Sale one-hit CD burn...very much the scenario that it appears that Audiostreet are proposing. If you're interested, I'll resurrect the article....
Internationally Affiliated Member of the Federated Union of Conundrums, Kudos, & Eccentric Dialogue, featuring the Scantily Clad Radii Of The Ubiquitous Meniscus - our motto "Time flies like an arrow - fruit flies like a banana"

Moonloop

Good thought out reply Gelert. Certainly wouldn't mind reading the article if you can find it.

Just to clarify one point which I obviously didn't put across very well. When I refer to taking copies, I mean in the same way that I used to tape albums back in the days of cassettes and this was purely to check out an album to see if it was worth buying or not. I only own a handful of CDRs & these are copies of collectibles which are nigh on impossible to get the originals of, if someone copies me an album and I like it then I bin the copy and buy the original. Any other approach, IMHO, and as you will undoubtably concur, is theft.

Phew.....glad I cleared that up  ;D

(live recordings are another matter altogether and possibly worthy of their own thread at some point in time  ;) )

The brainwashed do not know that they are brainwashed...

gelert

Quote from: Moonloop on Wed, 2005-02-09, 08:39:51
...if someone copies me an album and I like it then I bin the copy and buy the original....

Collect one "Get out of jail free" card from petty cash...

OK, the article is in November 2004 edition of Sound On Sound magazine - so my guess of 6 months was remarkably accurate...NOT...!

It features "The Association of Independent Music", headed-up by one Alison Wenham. If you're a subscriber to SOS, then you can view the 6-page article on the SOS website....6 pages of magazine A4 might be a little bit large to cut-and-paste here...but here are some quotes...

Part of the rationale behind forming AIM was a perception that the indies' on-line interests would diverge from those of the majors. "The Internet's a global distribution platform, and the majors obviously have the investment capability to exploit that opportunity, while the independents, left to their own individual devices, wouldn't necessarily have had as much opportunity or choice," says Wenham. "So we've worked extremely hard to give smaller companies access to on-line licensing services."

And I [Alison Wenham] gave a quote when the BPI announced they were intending to sue [file-sharing] customers, which was that AIM support efforts to control piracy but not to the extent that it means suing the customers. We do not endorse the suing of our customers. The independents are not culturally attuned to litigation. They would rather cut a deal, they would rather let bygones be bygones and find a pragmatic solution than throw lots and lots of lawyers and money at proving a point."


However, AIM are allegedly on www.musicindie.org (it sez 'ere...!), although I've not visited their site myself.
Internationally Affiliated Member of the Federated Union of Conundrums, Kudos, & Eccentric Dialogue, featuring the Scantily Clad Radii Of The Ubiquitous Meniscus - our motto "Time flies like an arrow - fruit flies like a banana"

Moonloop

Cheers. Will read later & let you know what I think   ;D
The brainwashed do not know that they are brainwashed...

Moonloop

Well Gelert, the AIM site is pretty impressive and has around 4 years of press releases for me to wade through..!! By co-incidence I actually own a 3CD promo sampler set from AIM (I recognised the logo when I first accessed the site  :) ) which I'd forgotten about, think it was issued in 2001 as some sort of collaboration with PopKomm in Germany and the Manchester Music scene. Small world, eh...

Anyway, cheers for the info....much reading to do.....

;D

The brainwashed do not know that they are brainwashed...

Xanxtuary

While on the subject of CD copying, there are other reasons for doing so ... as follows

I always buy original CDs wherever possible, but I make copies for taking out of the house, eg, for travel listening or holiday listening, so that if anything happens when I'm away, such as losing them, dropping them or having them stolen, then my precious originals are safe.  Car CD players often trash CDs, so having copies for the car is a good idea.

Sometimes, if I'm not sure about a band or artist, I will borrow from a friend, or get a copy from a friend, but if I genuinely like what I hear, then I go out and get the original.   I like to have the proper package, with the cover art, lyric booklet, etc, it all adds to the enjoyment of the musical experience, plus obviously it supports the artists and bands whom I admire.

I used to see market traders selling what were obvious homemade copies of cassettes (and in more recent times, CDs) quite openly, and as long as people buy them, they are going to keep selling them.

What I really dislike is when most of the proceeds of CD sales goes to the major recording companies and not to the artists/bands, which is why I'm all in favour of independent labels, cottage industries, etc, that way the artists reap more of the benefits.
Progpriestess Xanxtuary Hogweed

Moonloop

Yeah, good points Xanxtuary. I agree with that 100%  :)
The brainwashed do not know that they are brainwashed...