:: The Shattered Room ::

Me, well it's just gotta be with the big guy  ;D

Quote from: Moonloop on Tue, 2005-03-15, 16:54:34
Me, well it's just gotta be with the big guy  ;D

100% Ack.

I prefer the Fish-era, but the Hogarth-era is also good. The Fish-era resulted in four masterpieces and of the Hogarth-era not every album is good, but Brave and Marbles are masterpieces as well!

 Â  Modern Marillion goes from bad to worse.  :(

I never took the time to get into Marillion. :o Sorry!! Don't beat the crap out of me...

(Read the Silmarillion though... :P)

Quote from: Peter on Tue, 2005-03-15, 16:57:24
100% Ack.

And, according to the poll, so far it is.....


Anybody got a "swap for an Aggy"...?

Ach c'mon you lot, modern Marillion ain't so bad.  Brave is a terrific album, and even some of the more recent stuff is pretty good.  Interior Lulu from the .com album is a real masterpiece in my view, one of the best from either eras.

  In a varying degree, "Season's End", "Holidays In Eden" and "Brave" are the choices of the whole Hogarth-era. 

Quote from: CygnusX1 on Tue, 2005-03-15, 23:07:08
Ach c'mon you lot, modern Marillion ain't so bad.  Brave is a terrific album, and even some of the more recent stuff is pretty good.  Interior Lulu from the .com album is a real masterpiece in my view, one of the best from either eras.

True, they're not too bad. The problem is that "not too bad" has followed on from 4 classic, top drawer, must-have albums  ;D . When they release albums like "Radiation" you can't help but hold your head in your hands and despair  ::)

IMHO only, naturally  ;D

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Tue, 2005-03-15, 17:41:18
I never took the time to get into Marillion. :o Sorry!! Don't beat the crap out of me...

Ok.

(You really should though. Try "Clutching at Straws", if that doesn't press your buttons then no need to go any further with them  ;D )

Quote from: Moonloop on Wed, 2005-03-16, 08:26:52
True, they're not too bad. The problem is that "not too bad" has followed on from 4 classic, top drawer, must-have albums  ;D . When they release albums like "Radiation" you can't help but hold your head in your hands and despair  ::)

IMHO only, naturally  ;D

I'm probably going to incur a lot of wrath here, but I loved Fugazi when I first bought it about 5-6 years ago.  Have to say though it's wearing a bit thin with me now and I personally wouldn't put it in the must-have category any more.  I still love Script, but I'd have to say I think Season's End is maybe their best achievement (the crummy Hooks in You aside).

Yeah......I take your point and had I bought "Fugazi" (or any of the other Fish era ones) recently then I may well agree. However, from a personal point of view, I bought each one as it was released and so "grew up" with them so to speak and that's probably why I retain the fondness for them which I do (we're talking, what, over 20 years ago  :o )

If I were to be 100% honest then I'd probably admit that those albums may sound a little dated but nostalgia always kicks in and I end up defending them  ;D

(must play "Grendel" when I get home  ;) )

The dated aspect doesn't really bother me.  After all I think Seasons End probably fits into the "product of its time" category now too.  I probably just overplayed Fugazi a bit - needs to stay on the shelf for a few years methinks.  Anyway, This Strange Engine IMHO is the worst Marillion album - 'One Fine Day', 'Hope for the Future', the fake trumpet solo on '80 Days', and the 'epic' but ultimately ponderous title track. Yuck! ;D

  As for the worst Marillion effort, I think that "Radiation" is another suitable candidate. :P

Quote from: The Voyager on Wed, 2005-03-16, 15:37:30
  As for the worst Marillion effort, I think that "Radiation" is another suitable candidate. :P

"Radiation" is one of the worst albums EVER  ;)

Hey folks, please! This should not turn out to be some sort of Marillion-bashing place or whatever. After all, the guys surely have put a lot of hard work into their albums (like every other artist, too), and whether you like them or not is personal taste, right.

   Alas, a number of previous albums can leave a bad taste in the mouth. >:( 

Point well made, and taken Peter...

And they're a shining example of what can be achieved by an internet-led "cottage industry"....so much so, that Sound-On-Sound magazine did a article on Marylion, as a suggested template for a "model modern company"...

However, I simply don't like the newer stuff...it does nothing for me, from "This Strange Engine" onwards...

BUT, I can HIGHLY RECOMMEND the remastered two-CD set of "Fugazzi"...often to be found playing chez-moi...the 24-bit 're'-production is STAGGERINGLY good...and how did they get that bass-end from the original analogue tape, without triggering new sound modules....?

Try the Marillion website...http://www.marillion.com/discog/fugazi/index.html

@ £8-50 + VAT + P&P, it's a steal...

" Fish will be celebrating the 20-th anniversary of Misplaced Childhood with a special Return To Childhood tour. Artwork will be designed by Mark Wilkinson"...                                               Source:  http://www.the-company.com/

Quote from: Peter on Wed, 2005-03-16, 15:54:33
Hey folks, please! This should not turn out to be some sort of Marillion-bashing place or whatever. After all, the guys surely have put a lot of hard work into their albums (like every other artist, too), and whether you like them or not is personal taste, right.

Right...  ;)

I like all from Misplaced childhood and up until today. Seasons end the absolute favourite. Seeing as how much they have changed over the years, one shouldn't expect to like it all. Like Rush, for example. Almost all people I know have their own favourite periods. Mine started with Moving pictures and ended with Counterparts.
With Marillion, I'm lucky, I guess. When they changed their style, beginning with ...engine, I didn't fall off. I might have, but lucky for me, and by some twist of fate I guess, they changed into a style I also like.
Radiation has four really good songs, some ok tracks that are ruined for me by noise, and a few moments that do me no good. I agree it is a low point.
The Fish vs. Hogarth thing is a "battle" that's unavoidable, but still shouldn't be fought. Both are so unique that they can't be compared to anyone, much less to each other. Which of them really makes you feel?
Personally, I'm prone to like "good singers". Fish wasn't often heralded as a solid live singer, but he did the job in the studio, and most importantly, he got this HUGE x-factor, in addition to a really nice voice, and tons of passion. But for some reason, when I hear a singer that delivers a stellar performance, it moves me even more. Out of tune singing or obvious and cheap workarounds always leaves me a little cold, at the very best disturbs my enjoyment. (There are several explanations why a singer is out of tune on a stage, so that in itself is not enough to judge him by.)

Among my favourite singers are Steve Perry, Geoff Tate, John West, H, Bob Catley, Tony Mills... All people that normally deliver the goods. Still, I would prefer Fish if H didn't also have the x-factor, big time. I admire the way he's established himself as frontman of Marillion. It couldn't have been an easy job, taking over after the great scotsman. Many fans have given him great reception. Still, he's taken some shit through the years, too. I don't think that should be necessary. Do these people think that Marillion 2005 would sound like in the old days, if only Fish stayed? Look at what Queensrÿche came to with every single original bandmember intact. ("Hear in the now frontier") And there are others, I'm sure you have examples.

I want to thank both Marillion and Fish for all the music they create for me and anyone else interested. Right now, I'm listening to "Field of crows". A very enjoyable album that is a wee bit closer to "This strange engine" than "Fugazi" in style...

Quote from: Deenfan on Fri, 2005-03-18, 00:13:13
The Fish vs. Hogarth thing is a "battle" that's unavoidable, but still shouldn't be fought.

The poll is meant to be a bit 'tongue-in-cheek' and I assume/hope it's taken that way by everyone  ;)

Fish era - Clutching At Straws
H Era - Seasons End

Totally agree. :D

Yes, in fact, that is exactly how I feel. A good period, eh? :)

  ...And who of us supposed, what kind of metamorphosis would happen with Marillion?  :o

We could argue issues like these forever.  You only have to go on the Genesis message boards to see the endless Gabriel versus Collins debate.

I have to say that I preferred the Fish era, but I wonder in retrospect how much of that is down to nostalgia, because that period of my life was an eventful one, at which the teenage Padawan Xanxa was growing into herself, developing tastes and opinions, choosing the paths that lay ahead of her.  It was a time of wonderment and discovery for me, and I think that's got a lot to do with the way I see the Fish era of Marillion.

Until fairly recently, I never gave Hogarth a chance, but Hogweed has quite a few Hogarth Marillion albums in his collection and afterlistening to some of these, I do like quite a lot of the material.  It helps for me to see them as a different band, not the one of the Fish era, and that way I can accept and listen to the music for what it is, abandoning my former prejudices.

Having said that, I haven't liked a lot of Fish's solo efforts either, so I can only conclude that the chemistry which made Fish era Mariillion so great doesn't work on Fish alone.

That sums it up fairly well, methinks.

I have a theory that the music that you hear the most between let's say 12 and 17 forms your taste for the rest of your life. There might be examples that don't fit into that rule, but I'd say it fits very often...

I tried H Marillion several times, telling myself to not explicitly listen to H but let the music let in on me. Didn't work yet.

In the forum world of endless bickering, these two last posts, by Xanxtuary and our very own Peter, are great pleasures to read. The 12-17 point is a very good one, and will pretty much explain the why's and wherefore's of personal taste. That is an eventful and "shaping" part of life.
Very, very good input. Thanks.

Ah, shoot....

Whilst I don't dislike Marillion with "H", I have to draw the line somewhere...

I don't have enough hours in the day to listen to (ergo, buy all of the CDs by...) bands that I don't dislike...

There are other, different, bands to find - and thanks to Peter et al, I've discovered Ayreon, that "rings my bell"...

When IQ released "Subterreanea", I thought that they'd gone down the same route as Marylion...fortunately I was wrong, as "Seventh House" proved...!

And, IMHO, Fugazzi is STILL Silmarillion's strongest album.

12 - 17 eh...?
Well I saw Genesis at the tender age of 11, and reviewed "Script..." for ZigZag Magazine at the age of 19/20...

Guess that's the reason why.........................................................

(Fill in the blanks - best answer gets a crate of "beer smileys"..!)

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Tue, 2005-03-15, 17:41:18
I never took the time to get into Marillion. :o Sorry!! Don't beat the crap out of me...

In about two weeks your can hear them ;)  though I think you've already heard them at my place more than once

I'm goin for the Fish-era also, besides the cd's I have the original LP's right here (including Real to real and B-sides themselves and some maxisingles *a bit proud is ;))

Quote from: NijntjeRocks on Sun, 2005-03-20, 23:48:47
In about two weeks your can hear them ;)  though I think you've already heard them at my place more than once

I'm goin for the Fish-era also, besides the cd's I have the original LP's right here (including Real to real and B-sides themselves and some maxisingles *a bit proud is ;))

Didn't say I never heard them, just that I never took the time to sit back and listen to the music ;) But okay, in 2 weeks I will try to take some time and listen to them :)

Err... I've just posted some ideas on Marillion in the wrong topic... I guess I should think of an elegant way to cut it out and bring it here...  ::) Well, I'll post here, ande then I'll figure out what to do with the other one  :P

I was about to click on "Fish era", when I realised that I have 7 fav albums. Four are "Fish-era" (the whole Fish era), and three are "H-era" (Season's, Brave and Afraid Of), so maybe I should vote "no difference"... But then again, B'sides Themselves makes it 5-3 to Fish era, so it's decided :P

Nevetheless, I think the importance of the singer is overrated in this case. I finally came to this conclusion when I got to listen the Bonus Disc in Clutching at straws remaster. It showed me how there was a perfect continuum from Clutching till Season's, and how the sound of the voice can lead us to see a greater difference than the actual one. The musicians were heading slowly into a certain direction, and that did not depend (not mainly) on Fish or H, I think. All this really helped me to apreciate "all time" Marillion sparks in newer albums, so I turned from liking the forementioned H-albums as if they were from a different band to liking them as Marillion albums, without any distinction between them and older ones.

I just bought my first Marillion album: Misplaced Childhood. Whoopdeedoo! Sounds very good (Not great, but still, very good)

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2005-04-04, 13:58:13
I just bought my first Marillion album: Misplaced Childhood. Whoopdeedoo! Sounds very good (Not great, but still, very good)

Well done Appelmoes?? Move on to "Clutching at Straws" next  ;D

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2005-04-04, 13:58:13
I just bought my first Marillion album: Misplaced Childhood. Whoopdeedoo! Sounds very good (Not great, but still, very good)

Better late than never! Congrats!

Next album will be 'Script for a Jesters Tear', NijntjeRocks (http://forum.the-ricochet.net/index.php?action=profile;u=83) recommended it to me :)

Edit: Better now Peter? ;)

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2005-04-04, 18:10:45
Next album will be 'Script for a Jesters Tea', NijntjeRocks (http://forum.the-ricochet.net/index.php?action=profile;u=83) recommended it to me :)

Hey, they have a new one? About a famous english drink? Kewl ;)

No fun, the first four are all very recommendable...!

Slave, bring hither the soapbox, that I might regale these scurvvy knaves...


Adopts fake-Northern accent "Unn - accustumed as I am...t' public spe-e-kin, I'd just lyke to take this opportuun-ity to say Fugazzi"

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2005-04-04, 18:10:45
Next album will be 'Script for a Jesters Tear', NijntjeRocks (http://forum.the-ricochet.net/index.php?action=profile;u=83) recommended it to me :)

Edit: Better now Peter? ;)

Ahhhh..."Script"  8) Surely one of the greatest records of all time.......

The first 4 Marillion studio albums are essential, Script, Fugazi, Missplaced & Clutching. Better to have bought and listened to them in chronological order but what the hell, ENJOY  ;D  ;D

Quote from: Moonloop on Tue, 2005-04-05, 08:51:04
The first 4 Marillion studio albums are essential, Script, Fugazi, Missplaced & Clutching. Better to have bought and listened to them in chronological order but what the hell, ENJOY  ;D  ;D

Something I'll keep in mind, thanks!

I loved the Fish era, especially Script. However, the guys have done  a number of great things post Fish. And of course, that is what makes them progressive. Changes are good, in the positive direction. Even look at Genesis, yes, they stopped being "progressive" around Winds and Wuthering, but they did have some good music after that. I think Marillion has stayed in their own brand of progressive music. To me progressive is constantly trying new things. Marillion have definitely done that. THey will always be considered one of my favs. THough I find myself listening to "You Know He Knows" and "Market Square Heros" alot lately. They are in my playlist on my iPod Shuffle.

ok, enough rambling.

Ciao

True JeffMc, very true. The only thing I'd add is that I sometimes feel that Marillion try to change merely for change's sake, in some sort of quest to been seen as "contemporary" or "relevant" & in a lot of instances, it hasn't worked and achieved only a further thinning out of the fan base.

Still, they're well in control of their own destiny, so to speak & I dare say I'll keep buying the albums even if they're "not as good as they used to be"  ;)

Remember that the Castle years meant making songs under the whip to complete an album a year, thereby making money for the label. I liked the albums, but it doesn't seem like the band were very happy about some of the material, not mentioning the situation.
About changing: It may come from a desire to move as far away from old Genesis as possible... ;)

I like the H era ... my favourite is Seasons End (Easter ... what a song!!!) :o

Yeah, and the whole album is lyrical excellence. Try "Berlin" for instance. Much has been written about the wall, but never anything like this one. Fantastic.

I just expanded my Original Cd's Pimp-List (See sig.) with another Marillion album: Script for a Jester's Tear. Another "Fish-Album" so I still can't vote :)

I happen to prefer the current 'H' era Marillion.  It's probably because I like the idea of bands continuing playing when line ups change, and not disappearing.  Marillion have continued to make music, and found ways around things that other bands hadn't thought of.

To be honest, I don't think Marillion would still be here now if Fish was still in the band. -No disrespect to Fish, of course!  I just think that the departure of Fish made the band stronger, possibly.  Which is a good thing!

The latest album, Marbles is a fantastic package (I brought the "Double Album in a book" version) - Well worth it!! :)

And Mark Kelly's keyboard rig is something to behold as well! ;D

Quote from: The Voyager on Wed, 2005-03-16, 15:37:30
  As for the worst Marillion effort, I think that "Radiation" is another suitable candidate. :P

Radiation is great just listen at Under the Sun, is a great song!!!!!!!

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Tue, 2005-03-15, 17:41:18
I never took the time to get into Marillion. :o Sorry!! Don't beat the crap out of me...

(Read the Silmarillion though... :P)

I've read the Silmarillion, it's a nice book, but very complicated, a lot of names in it. You should read it too, but You'd better start with the other books first, if You don't like those You'll never like the Silmarillion. But don't be afraid it's impossible to make a film out of it, don't tell Peter Jackson he will start immediatly!! (or maybe do, I would like to see it, if it's a good one)

Silmarillion, the movie, would be a weird but maybe great thing to see... :o

Quote from: keyboardistmatt on Mon, 2005-06-13, 11:44:08
To be honest, I don't think Marillion would still be here now if Fish was still in the band. -No disrespect to Fish, of course!  I just think that the departure of Fish made the band stronger, possibly.  Which is a good thing!

But Fish also still makes music himself, his debute album: Vigil in a Wilderness of Mirrors is very good album, You should listen to it. After that album I think it went downwards with Fish until Fellini days. The latest Fish album Field of Crows is made in 2003 which is not too bad either.
But I also voted the H period, their highlight is still the Brave album, this is even better than the albums with Fish. Besides that I also like The Afraid of Sunlight Album very much, so much emotion to put in an Album, is just Fantastic. In fact their all very good, only Marillion.com is my least favourite one (excluding Interior Lulu, which is a Highlight).

Quote from: Appelmoes??(Read the Silmarillion though... :P)

Quote from: Herben on Fri, 2005-08-05, 00:35:36
You should read it too

I said I had read it ;) 6-7 times or so.

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Fri, 2005-08-12, 18:05:43
I said I had read it ;) 6-7 times or so.

I'm sorry I misunderstood You, I only read it once, so I don't have to tell You anything, You tell me.

Sorry, but it would be veeeeery offtopic ;)

Basically, I consider Marillion with Fish and Marillion with H as two different bands.

Marillion with Fish really got me into prog and those four albums indeed have an aura of nostalgia and the magic of the jester imagery surrounding them, but I prefer Marillion with H, it just moves me more, lyrics, vocals and the music.

My favourite albums are the "Dave Meegan albums", Brave, AOS, Anoraknophobia and Marbles, it's marvellous what this guy achieves with the band. He really is the sixth member!
This Strange Engine, Radiation and Marillion.com are my least favourite albums, they're not bad and each contains great tracks, but they're less consistent and the production is less good.

I'm passionate about Marillion and could write on and on, but as this an Arena forum I'll leave it at this..  ;)

Quote from: Moonloop on Wed, 2005-03-16, 15:44:22
"Radiation" is one of the worst albums EVER  ;)

No I would choose Marillion.com (not included Interior Lulu which is great)

Quote from: Herben on Wed, 2005-09-21, 22:39:48
No I would choose Marillion.com (not included Interior Lulu which is great)

I thought dotcom just edged R10 - close call though  :)

Quote from: Herben on Fri, 2005-08-12, 14:58:42
But Fish also still makes music himself, his debute album: Vigil in a Wilderness of Mirrors is very good album, You should listen to it.

I have heard "Vigil..." it was ok, but I prefered "Internal Exile" for some reason...

Quote from: Herben on Fri, 2005-08-12, 14:58:42
Besides that I also like The Afraid of Sunlight Album very much, so much emotion to put in an Album, is just Fantastic.

H seems alot more 'emotional' than Fish.  I think that's why the 'Brave' album was so good, because H is so emotional...

I'm back after a week away.

For me the Fish era, though I do like Brave.

Getting Misplaced Childhoood on CD and looking up Fish's solo career got me on the track to listening to Arena.

Cheers,

Ian

I finaly cast my vote :) I bought the album "best of both worlds" some time ago and have listened to it. If it's representable for the Fish and H era's, I like Fish's a lot more. H sounds ok, but it just misses the emotions I hear in Fish's singing, and sometimes it just sounds too slick and, dare I say it, like pop. I get the feeling the music was written to be airplay-material, and that's the worst reason to make music.

(I'm not saying they did, but I just get that feeling)

I don't mind either, really, although there have been a couple or three lesser albums in the H era. Neverland is one of the best songs they've ever recorded, imo  :)

I just voted here. I didn't vote before because I didn't know Marillion that well. But now I've listened to Misplaced Childhood, Script For A Jester's Tear, Anoraknophobia and Marbles.
I like both 'worlds'. I think Anoraknophobia is an album with a lot of good songs (I think (in my opinion) there's no weak song there), and Misplaced Childhood is a very emotional album with of course Kayleigh and Lavender being great songs. Misplaced Childhood reminds me of early Arena (I know, this should be the other way round, but you get the idea).

I don't mind, I like both worlds equally I think. (Anoraknophobia is (in my opinion (I know some people want to lynch me now, but...)) the best Marillion album I heard so far.)

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Thu, 2005-12-08, 20:43:28
I finaly cast my vote :) I bought the album "best of both worlds" some time ago and have listened to it. If it's representable for the Fish and H era's, I like Fish's a lot more. H sounds ok, but it just misses the emotions I hear in Fish's singing, and sometimes it just sounds too slick and, dare I say it, like pop. I get the feeling the music was written to be airplay-material, and that's the worst reason to make music.

(I'm not saying they did, but I just get that feeling)

The problem with best of both world from Marillion that they took the airplay songs so You're right but in my opinion not representable for the rest of the hogarth era. a lot of songs were taken from the holidays in eden cd which is a more popular cd. The brave songs they took the edit version. So the real highlights were only The space... , Made again,  King and afraid of sunlight. Apart from these they have songs as Interior Lulu, Easter (full version), This strange engine, Ocean cloud etc.
But it's much different than Arena, I never understood while people were saying Arena is a Marillion clone, maybe Immortal has a small marillion sauce poured over it but for the rest I don't see it...

Quote from: Herben on Tue, 2007-07-31, 18:10:34
But it's much different than Arena, I never understood while people were saying Arena is a Marillion clone, maybe Immortal has a small marillion sauce poured over it but for the rest I don't see it...

It's hard to deny that John Carson's voice and some parts of SFTLC don't remind of early Marillion, IMHO.

Quote from: Bupie on Wed, 2007-08-01, 09:32:59
It's hard to deny that John Carson's voice and some parts of SFTLC don't remind of early Marillion, IMHO.

It reminds You but it never reminded me of Marillion, it's like comparing U2 and Simple Minds

Quote from: Herben on Wed, 2007-08-01, 11:20:25
It reminds You but it never reminded me of Marillion, it's like comparing U2 and Simple Minds

Now that you mention it.

John Carson reminds me of Fish and Steve Hogarth reminds me of Bono sometimes.

Funny world.

Quote from: PH on Fri, 2007-08-03, 13:06:20
Now that you mention it.

John Carson reminds me of Fish and Steve Hogarth reminds me of Bono sometimes.

Funny world.

Mentioning Simple Minds above,  Marbles You're Gone reminds me a lot of Simple Minds ...

Quote from: Bupie on Tue, 2007-11-13, 17:16:55
I should have remembered since I have participated in those threads. Elzheimer begins ...  :-X

I am going to try to reactivate them but please don't restrain yourself then  ;)

[moves over to Marillion poll section and posts:]

Quote from: Bupie on Tue, 2007-11-13, 17:20:47
Mentioning Simple Minds above,  Marbles You're Gone reminds me a lot of Simple Minds ...

Mmm, appreciate your efforts, but a bit of a feeble attempt to be honest, Bupie. No need to constrain myself whatsoever ::)

Quote from: PH on Mon, 2006-03-20, 15:29:38
I don't mind, I like both worlds equally I think. (Anoraknophobia is (in my opinion (I know some people want to lynch me now, but...)) the best Marillion album I heard so far.)

Now Paco is saying some interesting things here, although it's a long time ago. Anoraknophobia is excellent, but I wouldn't single it out as their best album. Paco, has your view changed after listening to more of their albums or is Anorak still your fave?

Let's see if I can rank the H albums for me personally:

1. Brave
2. Afraid Of Sunlight
3. Marbles (it's a tie with number two really..)
4. Seasons End
5. Anoraknophobia
6. Holidays In Eden
7.This Strange Engine
8. Radiation
9. Marillion.com

I'm not including Somewhere Else in this ranking yet, as it's still too fresh/recent. But it's not likely to change the first 6 spots in this list.

I still really like Anoraknophobia. There are some very catchy songs on it and to me every song has something unique.

Now that I've heard Misplaced Childhood and Script For A Jester's Tear I can say that I cannot compare this to new Marillion. To me it's a completely new band.
Old-Marillion is lyrically a treasure and there's music on it. And the New-Marillion doesn't have "music", but "songs". Catchy songs. Lyrically they're not really that great.

From what I've heard so far from New-Marillion I like Anoraknophobia a lot! (Don't really like Brave... :-\ )
And from Old-Marillion I like both Script and Misplaced Childhood a lot!

If I had to rank these three albums in a top three I'd say:

Shut up.

You hit the nail on the head Paco, it is two different bands. I don't agree that the H lyrics aren't great though, he has penned quite a lot of lyrics that can move me to tears. Give Brave some more spins and follow the instructions on the back: "play it loud with the lights off!"

Quote from: erik on Tue, 2007-11-13, 22:10:04
You hit the nail on the head Paco, it is two different bands. I don't agree that the H lyrics aren't great though, he has penned quite a lot of lyrics that can move me to tears. Give Brave some more spins and follow the instructions on the back: "play it loud with the lights off!"

I can only agree with that for 100 %.  8)

Amazing album!  *horns*

Fish is for life!

Quote from: CompanyCroydon on Tue, 2007-11-13, 22:19:14
Fish is for life!

I knew you would say that.  :D

Quote from: maddox on Tue, 2007-11-13, 22:20:20
I knew you would say that.  :D

;D ;D ;D

Quote from: erik on Tue, 2007-11-13, 21:14:07
[moves over to Marillion poll section and posts:]

Mmm, appreciate your efforts, but a bit of a feeble attempt to be honest, Bupie. No need to constrain myself whatsoever ::)

You are right, Erik, it was just a "re-start" remark without great interest (even if the similarities with Simple Minds really strike me each time I hear this song but this is an isolated case).

But Marillion is a band that has been a big part of my musical environment for 25 years so I think that I can go a little "deeper" in my comparison of both eras.

First thing is the age factor. I am 42 and you are 30. Which means that you were probably not comtemporaneous -at least in your musical interests- of the Fish era. I was. And being a teenager or in his early 20's when an album is released often means that it strikes you more because you are fresh, open, naive and receptive to the music. No "déjà vu" feeling to hold up your enthousiasm. Misplaced Childhood really hit me right in the face and made emotions explode inside. And it still does. When Brave was released, I was almost 30, I had a job, non progrock fans friends, a TV  :-[, was practicing different sports on numerous evenings ... In a word, I had  less time for demanding music. And Brave, for me, is a VERY demanding album. I mean, when you are told to by a member of the band himself to turn off the lights and put headphones to appreciate an album, this is an indication that the road wo'nt be so easy.

Second, in Marillion's case, is the singer looks. I do think that H is handsome when Fish is, well, Fish ... And it might sound silly to most of you but it's more difficult for me to get moved by the smooth and seemingly emotionless H's face and voice than by the tormented Fish. I saw both of them in concert and this impression was confirmed : Fish is as charismatic as can be when H is just an elegant but not outstanding frontman. Maybe there is also a social factor, Fish representing the popular and struggling average guy when H embodies the flourishing middle to upper class man. And I definitively feel closer to the former. I realize that this is very personal but, since I am just the average guy with average feelings and tastes, maybe some other average old Marillion fans feel the same.

Third and last is the music itself. Even with a long musical background, I still can be overwhelmed by new bands or albums that I discover. It's been the  case with Arena's Contagion, Magenta's Seven or DT's SDOIT, for instance. This is not the case with post HiE H's Marillion. For each album, I have to struggle a LOT to get into the music. Most of the time, it's finally rewarding (so far I think of Marbles and TSE mainly) but it is a long and sometimes even painful purchase : actually, I am fighting with Anoraknophobia and I gave up with AoS (but will return to it someday). I would not do that for any other band, frankly ... Still, I am on the easy listening side of prog so maybe most of new Marillion stuff is just not for me ?

Anyway, I do think that H does a great job with Marillion in his own way and I am happy that the band is still alive and kicking (no Simple Minds pun intended) after all those years.

Was it a better effort, this time, Erik ? At least, it's a sincere and personal one. The proof ? Almost no smiley in my post  ;)

Real nice musical "autobiography", Bupie - and in excellent English  :)

Helped me know you better.

You even got me to add Magenta's Seven on my SL (the other albums you mentioned, I have).

This discussion sure has revived our excitement about Marillion.

Thanks guys.

Nicky.

That's more like it! Seriously, thank you Bupie for this extensive personal post which I enjoyed reading very much and which hits the core of it all: the interaction between what's going on in your own life (especially while a teenager) and the music that is associated with it. For now just this short first comment & thanks, I will sit down and really reply later!

Bupie, you're speaking right out of my heart.

What we should note is that what Bupie expresses here would be Erik's "1. stage", which was followed by Erik's "2. stage", the "Brave" stage, if I'v understood this whole business correctly.

Nicky.

Quote from: Peter on Sat, 2007-11-17, 10:15:18
Bupie, you're speaking right out of my heart.

Thanks Peter  :)

Quote from: Nicky007 on Sat, 2007-11-17, 11:27:59
What we should note is that what Bupie expresses here would be Erik's "1. stage", which was followed by Erik's "2. stage", the "Brave" stage, if I'v understood this whole business correctly.

Not sure Nicky.  Erik was probably just too young for my "1.stage" and I had too many preconceived ideas on Marillion's music for his "2.stage". But Brave is certainly a turning point in the band's career. it's very interesting to read members of the band's views on it on their website. More broadmindedly, it is very interesting to visit marillion.com because there are a lot of informations to be found on their past and present career.

At this stage I'm thoroughly confused ???

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2007-11-19, 12:43:18
At this stage I'm thoroughly confused ???

Even more than usual, Appy?  ;D

Nicky.

Indeed, that's how confusing it is ;D

Confused about WHAT?

If I only knew ???

Quote from: Appelmoes?? on Mon, 2007-11-19, 18:45:08
If I only knew ???

I have to admit I am bit confused too  :D

Quote from: Bupie on Tue, 2007-11-20, 09:48:52
I have to admit I am bit confused too  :D

Comon Bupie, not U2. I think you summed it up nicely in your last post on the matter.

How's the Second Sistine Chapel comin about?

Nicky.

Is there already anyone who has the newest album from Fish, Thirteenth star? Is it a good one?

Quote from: Herben on Thu, 2007-11-22, 23:39:49
Is there already anyone who has the newest album from Fish, Thirteenth star? Is it a good one?

I heard that Maddox had it and didn't like it really that much (yet).

I haven't got it, I'm just starting with my Marillion collection. ;D


-Paco

Quote from: Herben on Thu, 2007-11-22, 23:39:49
Is there already anyone who has the newest album from Fish, Thirteenth star? Is it a good one?

I bought the SE with the bonus DVD but didn't find time to watch it so far. I had a few listens of the album but it's too soon to give you a definitive answer. At this point, I am not impressed but I think that after a few more plays I could like it a lot ... I'll let you know.