Author Topic: Nicky007  (Read 96340 times)

Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #50 on: Wed, 2007-07-25, 10:10:19 »
Will be nice to have your opinion on it, Nicky.

I certainly will, Bupie (once I've become a breatharian and can save money on food and spend it on CD's instead  ;D), and you'll give me your take on Paradise Lost (although for Frenchies, France is Paradise). Start with The Sacrifice (track 9), and let it spellbind you, like it has me (and seemingly Maddox).

I think you once said that you liked the Room best of all music forums. I agree with you. So, kudos to Cap, and to the rest of you guys. As Jasun Tipton would say, You rule!  :D

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Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #51 on: Wed, 2007-07-25, 10:26:49 »
Speaking of reviews, here is another one taken from Progarchives http://www.progarchives.com/Review.asp?id=36490 : not from me but it sums up pretty well my feeling about EOP ... that doesn't sound AT ALL like I&W IMHO.

I read that some Roomers like this album and I know that most DT fans like it too. That's fine with me (and for James, I guess  :)) but I don't share their feelings on this one.

There seem to be real big differences in the take on this album. As I've gotten around to liking James, I'll have to give it a proper listen. Objectively seen, I don't consider James a "great" singer, but, you know, it's like with the wife of your best friend: You might not think that she's the greatest woman on earth, but you get around to liking her, because you start seeing her through the eyes of your friend, who loves her (in principle, at least); and the DT guys are some of my best friends, although it's not reciprocal (yet), so .... I guess one could spin a lot of psychology on this one.  :D

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Offline maddox

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #52 on: Wed, 2007-07-25, 20:58:23 »

I too felt sorry that James was not more involved in DT's writing process but after listening to EOP, I have a beginning of explanation ...

I agree with you on this, Bupie. The strange thing with DT is that most lyrics are written by Portnoy/Petruci. Which is a shame since both James Labrie and John Myung for instance has written pretty nice lyrics for DT in the past. As a singer James isn't really a top vocalist, in fact i sometimes label him as the 'weakest link' in DT. On the album he's fine (which i would be too by the way  ;)) but live he always was ehm...not very good. But he also isn't a great songwriter. With any other band you never know who wrote a specific song and if you would you couldn't tell the difference since the writing was the same. But that isn't the case with DT. You can always tell if the lyric was written by James or was written by the other two.
But on the other hand that what makes James' solo albums so personal and quite good. If you let go of the thought that James is the vocalist of DT that you are listening to a good prog/rock/metal album.

But as always, each to his own opinion of course.

Quote
*abouth EOP: that doesn't sound AT ALL like I&W IMHO.


I definitely agree.  :o
Anyone who wrote that should do a crash course in DT all over again and again.

There's no album in the world which you can compare Images & Words with.  :-\

Oh, and nicky: hope you don't mind this rather long post of mine.  ;)
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Offline erik

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #53 on: Mon, 2007-10-01, 13:21:52 »
Kudos, Nicky, for your extensive and informative listening profile! *horns*

And interesting Dream Theater discussion earlier on in this thread (page 1). I love DT! I’m not sure a big change occurred between Scenes and Six Degrees, I think the change between Infinity and Scenes is much bigger. DT did a “Marillion” there (releasing an ambitious, complex, epic concept masterpiece after releasing their most poppy, record company influenced album), Infinity can be viewed as their Holidays In Eden and Scenes as their Brave (and to draw the analogy further, Six Degrees as their Marbles). My thoughts on their albums (from I&W onwards, don’t have their debut):

Images And Words: Great songs, but I don’t like the polished production, least of all the horrible thin ‘80s plastic sound of the drums (ABWH comes to mind with Bruford on the electronic drum kit). But not to be dismissed as it is one of the foundations of progressive metal.

Awake: The first DT album I got, blew me away and still my third favourite DT album. A lot more heavy and aggressive than I&W and a much better production, a more organic and less polished sound. Maybe because I started with this one and got to know I&W later on the latter was a bit of a disappointment. And to all the critics who say DT’s music is void of emotion: just listen to Space-Dye Vest!

A Change Of Seasons: The title track is a great epic! I don’t listen to the live songs often.

Falling Into Infinity: Their most "commercial" one, but still good. Love Trial Of Tears and Peruvian Skies.

Scenes From A Memory: They wanted to do a classic concept album DT-style and succeeded marvellously! My favourite DT album.

Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence: Stunning album, although I prefer and mostly just listen to disc 1. My fourth favourite DT-album.

Train Of Thought: They wanted to do a classic metal album DT-style and succeeded marvellously! My second favourite DT-album.

Octavarium: I’m divided on this one. It’s a good album but it doesn’t really capture me somehow, don’t know why as it does have all the ingredients and great songs.

Systematic Chaos: On my shopping list, the snippets I’ve heard and the reviews made me drool. :P
« Last Edit: Mon, 2007-10-01, 13:26:53 by erik »
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Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #54 on: Mon, 2007-10-01, 16:33:35 »
Kudos, Nicky, for your extensive and informative listening profile! *horns*

And interesting Dream Theater discussion earlier on in this thread (page 1). I love DT! I’m not sure a big change occurred between Scenes and Six Degrees, I think the change between Infinity and Scenes is much bigger. DT did a “Marillion” there (releasing an ambitious, complex, epic concept masterpiece after releasing their most poppy, record company influenced album), Infinity can be viewed as their Holidays In Eden and Scenes as their Brave (and to draw the analogy further, Six Degrees as their Marbles).

Very interesting comparison. I must confess that I prefer HiE to Brave and FII to SFAM but, as you can see with my avatar, I don't have problems with albums with a more poppy/commercial approach  :) The difference between the two bands is that Marillion still uses and outside producer when Portnoy and Petrucci handle the production duties since SFAM.

It's also amazing to see that, despite playing totally different kinds of music, Marillion and DT share a lot of fans.

By the way, am I the only one to thing that Petrucci's solo on Take away my Pain is pure Rothery  ???

Quote
My thoughts on their albums (from I&W onwards, don’t have their debut):

Images And Words: Great songs, but I don’t like the polished production, least of all the horrible thin ‘80s plastic sound of the drums (ABWH comes to mind with Bruford on the electronic drum kit). But not to be dismissed as it is one of the foundations of progressive metal.

Awake: The first DT album I got, blew me away and still my third favourite DT album. A lot more heavy and aggressive than I&W and a much better production, a more organic and less polished sound. Maybe because I started with this one and got to know I&W later on the latter was a bit of a disappointment. And to all the critics who say DT’s music is void of emotion: just listen to Space-Dye Vest!

A Change Of Seasons: The title track is a great epic! I don’t listen to the live songs often.

Falling Into Infinity: Their most "commercial" one, but still good. Love Trial Of Tears and Peruvian Skies.

Scenes From A Memory: They wanted to do a classic concept album DT-style and succeeded marvellously! My favourite DT album.

Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence: Stunning album, although I prefer and mostly just listen to disc 1. My fourth favourite DT-album.

Train Of Thought: They wanted to do a classic metal album DT-style and succeeded marvellously! My second favourite DT-album.

Octavarium: I’m divided on this one. It’s a good album but it doesn’t really capture me somehow, don’t know why as it does have all the ingredients and great songs.

Systematic Chaos: On my shopping list, the snippets I’ve heard and the reviews made me drool. :P

If I had to make a ranking of DT albums, it would be :

1. I&W : Wonderful from beginning to end (agree with you on the drums sound, though). Definitively a classic of prog-metal
2. SDOIT : their proggiest and most versatile album. A double CD with zero defect (well, OK, Misunderstood could have been two minutes shorter) !
3. FII : it has its ups and downs but the ups (especially Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears) are very, very up ...
4. ACOS : great epic and very emotive Elton John's covers. The other covers are good too.
5. Awake : a dark gem but I must admit that I don't play it so often because the most metallish (?) songs don't fit my taste (Lie, The Mirror, Scarred)
6. Octavarium  : very eclectic. Honestly, there is not one song on it that I don't like but so far, I don't see the masterpiece that others see in the title track
7. Systematic Chaos : it lacks a bit of eccentricity but all songs vary from good to excellent. I think an outisde producer would have helped, though
8. ToT : I'm not a metal fan so it's not easy for me to swallow this one in one piece but I also lack the great melodies that fulfil their other albums. But every DT fan has to have it, at least for SoC  *horns*
9. WDADU : good debut album with lot of promises but, all in all, it's just an average heavy metal album IMHO

Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #55 on: Tue, 2007-10-02, 09:07:52 »
If I had to make a ranking of DT albums, it would be :

1. I&W : Wonderful from beginning to end (agree with you on the drums sound, though). Definitively a classic of prog-metal
2. SDOIT : their proggiest and most versatile album. A double CD with zero defect (well, OK, Misunderstood could have been two minutes shorter) !
3. FII : it has its ups and downs but the ups (especially Lines in the Sand and Trial of Tears) are very, very up ...
4. ACOS : great epic and very emotive Elton John's covers. The other covers are good too.
5. Awake : a dark gem but I must admit that I don't play it so often because the most metallish (?) songs don't fit my taste (Lie, The Mirror, Scarred)
6. Octavarium  : very eclectic. Honestly, there is not one song on it that I don't like but so far, I don't see the masterpiece that others see in the title track
7. Systematic Chaos : it lacks a bit of eccentricity but all songs vary from good to excellent. I think an outisde producer would have helped, though
8. ToT : I'm not a metal fan so it's not easy for me to swallow this one in one piece but I also lack the great melodies that fulfil their other albums. But every DT fan has to have it, at least for SoC  *horns*
9. WDADU : good debut album with lot of promises but, all in all, it's just an average heavy metal album IMHO

Woups, I forgot SFAM  :-[  Is it a sign ?

I guess it would rank at position n° 8, (far) ahead of ToT. There is so much praise about this album that I was a little bit deceived when I finally got it. What can I say : it's good but it's just too much. Slightly overrated IMHO.

Offline johninblack

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #56 on: Tue, 2007-10-02, 09:36:29 »
1. SDOIT
2. SFAM
3. Octavariun
4. ToT
5. SC
6. I & W
7. Awake
8.ACOS
9. WDADU
10. FII

For me SDOIT and SFAM are way out in front and will always fill positions 1 & 2. The rest are like most lists of favorites, subject to change for no reason other than mood, and which one I played last

Offline PH

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #57 on: Tue, 2007-10-02, 18:52:41 »
2. SDOIT : their proggiest and most versatile album. A double CD with zero defect (well, OK, Misunderstood could have been two minutes shorter) !

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
I REALLY like that song from start to very finish!

-Paco

Offline maddox

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #58 on: Tue, 2007-10-02, 18:54:07 »
Make room.  :P

1 -  Metropolis pt II: Scenes From A Memory
2 - Images & Words
3 - Six Degrees Of Inner Turbulence
4 - Awake/Train Of Thought  ;D
6 - Systematic Chaos
7 - Octavarium
8 - Falling Into Infinity
9 - When Day & Dream Unite

You may have noticed that i not voted for A Change Of Seasons. Though one of the best epics i've ever heard, it isn't really an album. So.. ;)
« Last Edit: Wed, 2007-10-03, 19:53:12 by maddox »
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Offline maddox

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #59 on: Tue, 2007-10-02, 19:02:30 »
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
I REALLY like that song from start to very finish!

-Paco

Seconded!!!  :o :o :o

Each to his own of course.  ;)
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Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #60 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 09:48:20 »
Seconded!!!  :o :o :o

Each to his own of course.  ;)

But I DO love it too  >:( They just should have turned all those electric apparels off when they left the studio after recording the song ...  ;)

Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #61 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 09:50:47 »

You may have noticed that i not voted for A Change Of Seasons. Though one of the best epics i've ever heard, it isn't really an album. So.. ;)

Yes but it still exceeds 60 minutes of playing time ...  :)

Offline erik

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #62 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 13:00:22 »
Very interesting comparison. I must confess that I prefer HiE to Brave and FII to SFAM but, as you can see with my avatar, I don't have problems with albums with a more poppy/commercial approach  :) The difference between the two bands is that Marillion still uses and outside producer when Portnoy and Petrucci handle the production duties since SFAM.

It's also amazing to see that, despite playing totally different kinds of music, Marillion and DT share a lot of fans.

By the way, am I the only one to thing that Petrucci's solo on Take away my Pain is pure Rothery  ???
Yeah, despite the differences DT and Marillion seem to go together well, don't they. I will listen to Take Away My Pain bearing that in mind, hadn't noticed.

I also like more poppy, commercial stuff like Asia, ELO, Alan Parsons Project for instance, no problem with that (however Are You Sitting Comfortably and Nomzamo are the only two IQ albums I don't have ;D).

Actually, I probably play Holidays In Eden more often than Brave. Veering into off off topicness here, but I want to make the observation that's a problem with long concept albums, you don't play them often, because they need to be heard from beginning to end and you may not find the moment often, especially not for the double albums. In my case this goes for Brave, Scenes From A Memory, Generation 13, Subterranea, Electric Castle, Wall, Lamb... The concept albums I play most are the more concise Dark Side Of The Moon, Misplaced Childhood and also The Visitor and Contagion. Arena had a point in limiting the latter to a single album not crammed up til 80 minutes instead of a double album.

Do I see Peter looming with that stick again ;D
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Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #63 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 13:30:34 »
I also like more poppy, commercial stuff like Asia, ELO, Alan Parsons Project for instance, no problem with that

Hey, come on, Erik, listen once more to the lyrics of Asia and E.L.O.. They're so banal that it makes even early Beatles seem philosophical.

I was high on E.L.O. once, long ago, even went to a concert with'm, but I wasn't either thinking much about lyrics in those days. Despite Jeff Lynne's obvious musical talent, he was on automatic pilot when he wrote his lyrics.

Alan Parsons Project, that's a completely different kettle of fish ("just two lost souls ...."). Alan was around the Floyd guys too much to be run-of-the-mill  ;D

> Do I see Peter looming with that stick again?

Peter is a very lenient Cap. He lets us romp - and prob laughs a bit and thinks "man, what a freak show!"  :D

Nicky.
« Last Edit: Wed, 2007-10-03, 15:20:30 by Nicky007 »
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Offline erik

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #64 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 19:27:05 »
Hey, come on, Erik, listen once more to the lyrics of Asia and E.L.O.. They're so banal that it makes even early Beatles seem philosophical.

I was high on E.L.O. once, long ago, even went to a concert with'm, but I wasn't either thinking much about lyrics in those days. Despite Jeff Lynne's obvious musical talent, he was on automatic pilot when he wrote his lyrics.
I agree you have to (be able to) largely ignore the lyrics, but musicwise it's enjoyable and infectious stuff. Good to sing along to in the car. The heat goes on! *horns* Another advantage is that with these bands I have someting I can put on that my girlfriend actually likes ::)

Quote
Alan Parsons Project, that's a completely different kettle of fish ("just two lost souls ...."). Alan was around the Floyd guys too much to be run-of-the-mill  ;D
Good pun ;) , but the APP lyrics are a mixed bag, there are some pretty cheesy lyrics among those as well!
« Last Edit: Wed, 2007-10-03, 19:49:43 by erik »
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Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #65 on: Wed, 2007-10-03, 23:56:05 »
Another advantage is that with these bands I have someting I can put on that my girlfriend actually likes ::)

Yeah, I know that one too (but don't tell her that I said it).

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Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #66 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 00:04:38 »
Good to sing along to in the car

You mean you even sing this stuff  :o  It's gettin worse and worse. Next thing is that you tell us that you put it on together with the candlelights and Bordeaux for your romantic rendezvous.

Nicky.
« Last Edit: Thu, 2007-10-04, 01:07:28 by Nicky007 »
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Offline erik

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #67 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 09:07:56 »
Next thing is that you tell us that you put it on together with the candlelights and Bordeaux for your romantic rendezvous.
I'm not telling you what I put on at those occasions 8), but rest assured that they are Asia-free ::)
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Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #68 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 10:04:34 »
I'm not telling you what I put on at those occasions 8), but rest assured that they are Asia-free ::)

Yes, you put on the John Wetton solo albums instead  :D  ;D

Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #69 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 10:07:49 »
I also like more poppy, commercial stuff like Asia, ELO, Alan Parsons Project for instance, no problem with that (however Are You Sitting Comfortably and Nomzamo are the only two IQ albums I don't have ;D).

It's not too late to get them  ;)

Quote
Veering into off off topicness here, but I want to make the observation that's a problem with long concept albums, you don't play them often, because they need to be heard from beginning to end and you may not find the moment often, especially not for the double albums. In my case this goes for Brave, Scenes From A Memory, Generation 13, Subterranea, Electric Castle, Wall, Lamb...

So true : it took me months to get to the end of Subterranea second CD : I always had to leave the home/car before it ended ...

Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #70 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 11:02:10 »
So true : it took me months to get to the end of Subterranea second CD : I always had to leave the home/car before it ended ...

Right, it can be a slow process getting to know a CD or book properly from beginning to end. But what I experience is that if it's real great stuff, then I keep returning to it, and I get so familiar with the well-tried material that I can quickly get to the new stuff, and slowly I get through it all.

That's been the case with the Arena- and DT-albums, because they're so rich that I can't absorb an entire CD the first few times.

With the Monte-Cristo book, I'm still prowling around the first chapter, because it's so rich in expression, both linguistically and emotionally; I'v now spent about thirty hours on the first ten pages of this book, but I consider that they'v been well spent.

Rather go in depth with the best than f* around with mediocre stuff (I'm thinking mainly of albums, books, and films here, Paco). I think that's something that comes with age, isn't it Bupie?

Nicky.
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Offline Nicky007

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #71 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 11:13:32 »
Yes, you put on the John Wetton solo albums instead  :D  ;D

I'm sure Paco could get something out of that   ;D

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Offline PH

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #72 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 13:57:29 »
I really should try the John Wetton albums. JM's on it eh?

Offline Bupie

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #73 on: Thu, 2007-10-04, 14:26:32 »
I really should try the John Wetton albums. JM's on it eh?

Yes, on the most recents ones and on the Icon albums. Haven't heard them so far. I only know Battle Lines and this one is without JM.

Offline PH

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Re: Nicky007
« Reply #74 on: Sat, 2007-10-06, 19:42:39 »
What do you guys recommend of John Wetton's stuff? Do you at all?

-Paco